Tires [Archive] - Pontiac G6 Forum

miscreant

11-21-2005, 05:43 PM

Some tires are simply provide more traction, or are more resistant to spinning, on wet pavement than others. The Continentals are some of the worst.I'm purely aware of that, I've just read several threads simply stating "my tires spin off the line and they must be crap" or the like, and while I agree both the LS2s and Continentals, and just about any other OEM tire sucks, that even the best will spin off the line in a FWD car with this power in the wet, period. How much they spin, and how quickly they eventually hookup will differentiate the good ones from the bad ones.

I also beg to differ in the amount of torque available down low. While this is not a discussion about this, but about tires, the 3.5 and 3.9 both put 85% - 90% of their peek torque down slightly above 1000 rpm. The car's weight can mask this feeling and subsequently cause even more tire spin in an effort to move the heavier vehicle.

And let's not bring WOT into this, because the difference in tq-power between partial tip-in to full tip-in is minimal.

S8ER99

11-21-2005, 06:02 PM

I will have to take your word for that.. ;)

miscreant

11-21-2005, 08:03 PM

I will have to take your word for that.. ;)All I'm saying is that the heavy G6 will be more difficult to move initially. And even at 1/2 throttle, your torque figure is still substantially high, high enough to break free if a friction inhibitor, like water, is present given the weight of the vehicle. How quickly the tire evacuates the water and bites to finally create movement would indicate how good of a tire it is, but it's still going to spin no matter how good it is, I guarantee it.

S8ER99

11-21-2005, 08:42 PM

miscreant

11-21-2005, 09:59 PM

haha..sorry wasn't disputing everything you said... I was just refering to the last part.. I dont have any hard data to show what the percentage difference is WOT vs partial throttle so I was merely saying I will have to take your word for it. :)
I don't have any hard core either, but general rule of thumb is 1/4 = 60%, 1/2 = 75%, 3/4 = 90%...Though every car is different to some extent. I've had a couple cars that were easily 99%+ at 3/4, with only transmission changes/adjustments occuring at WOT (quicker kickdown) etc. My 04 goat would run within .5 sec (I should say less than .5 sec) of my WOT quarter mile times with the gas pedal blocked to approx. 3/4 throttle (long story, it was a bet...kinda like a "one hand tied behind my back" thing...)

S8ER99

11-22-2005, 07:12 AM

I don't have any hard core either, but general rule of thumb is 1/4 = 60%, 1/2 = 75%, 3/4 = 90%...Though every car is different to some extent. I've had a couple cars that were easily 99%+ at 3/4, with only transmission changes/adjustments occuring at WOT (quicker kickdown) etc. My 04 goat would run within .5 sec (I should say less than .5 sec) of my WOT quarter mile times with the gas pedal blocked to approx. 3/4 throttle (long story, it was a bet...kinda like a "one hand tied behind my back" thing...)
The 04 Goat also had a traditional Throttle linkage. :) I thought this throttle by wire crap was more precise.

miscreant

11-22-2005, 08:19 AM

The 04 Goat also had a traditional Throttle linkage. :) I thought this throttle by wire crap was more precise.

Yes, DBW sucks. The 05 GTO has it, and it's plagued with slow response and failures (and parts availability problems from AU). DBW needed a little more work before they put it into performance cars...

S8ER99

11-22-2005, 10:40 AM

Agreed. :( next car is definately not going to have that on it.

otcpharm

11-22-2005, 01:09 PM

I'm purely aware of that, I've just read several threads simply stating "my tires spin off the line and they must be crap" or the like, and while I agree both the LS2s and Continentals, and just about any other OEM tire sucks, that even the best will spin off the line in a FWD car with this power in the wet, period. How much they spin, and how quickly they eventually hookup will differentiate the good ones from the bad ones.

Well, the rest of us were apparently able to better discern the gist of the statements since we didn't feel the need to debate the semantics of missing clarifiers.

The answers were therefore geared toward providing a better traction solution for wet weather. Everything that was said was factually correct, all replies were likewise factually correct.

Why toss in a "yeah, but..." when it doesn't contribute anything except pointing out something that is blatantly obvious to everybody here?

miscreant

11-22-2005, 08:45 PM

Why toss in a "yeah, but..." when it doesn't contribute anything except pointing out something that is blatantly obvious to everybody here?Why? Because I got two PMs within 1 hour of each other (one here and one at ls1gto.com) from people with the potenzas asking my advice as to whether they should replace their tires and if they were any good because they "spun off the line in wet weather".

So it's apparently NOT blatantly obvious to everyone...

otcpharm

11-23-2005, 10:37 AM

Why? Because I got two PMs within 1 hour of each other ...

Ah....PM's.

I never carry over PM material into the board, so that's never a consideration when I post. Thanks for clearing it up.

It baffles the mind to think that ANYBODY would think they'd be able to dig up tires that WON'T spin on wet streets - regardless of what you drive.

miscreant

11-23-2005, 10:57 AM

I never carry over PM material into the board, so that's never a consideration when I post. Thanks for clearing it up.
I get PMs on LS!GTO all the time from people who have 3-4 posts at most, but have been registered for 6 months. I guess they just PM people and never post. The questions typically are questions that might get flamed, so I can understand some of the motivation.

It baffles the mind to think that ANYBODY would think they'd be able to dig up tires that WON'T spin on wet streets - regardless of what you drive.I know alot of people that have been owners of "less-than-particularly-powerful" cars that may have moved up to their first "over 100 lbs/ft tq to-the-ground engine" and are surprised by the low-end tq.

S8ER99

11-23-2005, 03:31 PM

I have had several vehicles with good tires that would not spin on wet streets. Regardless of power...

It is a given that if you go nailing the throttle from a dead stop on wet pavement you get tire spin (even in 100hp honda/geos, etc) I guess I am thinking while moving faster than 10 or 15mph.

Smiles

11-23-2005, 04:14 PM

S8ER99

11-23-2005, 04:44 PM

Thanks for the info..

I am pretty sure the tires that came on my car are all season. All season certainly includes snow/ice. :) LOL

miscreant

11-23-2005, 08:19 PM

New to the forum....Hello to you all,

Just a heads up on tires.....GM did not design there 17" Chromies, 17" Aluminum Painted, 18" Aluminum and 18" Ultras wheels for winter use. Go hit up your local dealer and pick up some medium grade bridges for $1000 and save you wheels! If you are rolling around on 16"....either hubs on steel wheels or 5 spokes you should be fine in winter. Do not put you performance tires through a winter or you will be paying for it on the end.....lets not forget about stone chips an scratches from sand and salt save those rims! I hope this helps.

P.S. Your G6 GTP and others require a special type of winter tire because of the bolt pattern so here in London you can only purchase them at your local dealership.....might be different on Toronto.....

Smiles :confused: I think I made out about half the above.

Also, the bolt pattern has NOTHING to do with what tires will fit on the car, and there's no special winter tire because of the bolt pattern.

Additionally, any of the wheels will hold up well in the winter as long as you keep them clean.

And what are medium grade bridges, and how do they save my wheels? lol. :rolleyes:

otcpharm

11-23-2005, 08:57 PM

I know alot of people that have been owners of "less-than-particularly-powerful" cars that may have moved up to their first "over 100 lbs/ft tq to-the-ground engine" and are surprised by the low-end tq.

Yes, so do I. And every one of them will still spin the tires on wet pavement.

Smiles

11-25-2005, 02:27 PM

S8ER99

11-25-2005, 04:44 PM

Thanks for the 'info'

miscreant

11-25-2005, 06:11 PM

Bridgestone tires.....bridges.....not a hard one to understand....well thats what we call them in the business.....and most ppl know about medium grade tires so ppl should understand that too......and yes they say all season unless its a G6 summer performance tire.....and yes they say MS on the side of the tire meaning mud and snow, but save your rims guys put on some winter wheels with a steel rim. MAN what an unwarm welcome!! In Canada you can only get winter wheels from certain places for a G6 and thats why I was talking about the bolt pattern so it DOES effect what tire you buy because there is not a lot to chose from and there are only certain places you can buy them!! And its still not a good idea to ride on chrome wheels all winter.....try to preserve the value of your car!! Dirt and Snow will beat them up esspecially if you do highway driving!! Do I need to get some pictures of damaged rims to prove it? Cause I will..........oh and miscreant did you want to write it in french? would that make it easier for you cause I can.....or I can bold the text or something.......

Have a good weekend guys,

SmilesWell, maybe it's some lingo from canada, but I was "in the business" and to some extent still am, and never heard bridgestones called 'bridges' and also never defined a level of tire as 'mid grade' - there's mid-grade gas, yes...So perhaps it would have been better to write it in layman's terms for people who "aren't in the business" as probably most who read this aren't.

Also, I guess you could say that the bolt pattern reduces the amount of selection of winter wheels you can find, and subsequently limits the tire sizes that appropriately fit on those wheels, which subsequently limits the tire selection for winter. But just saying "Your G6 GTP and others require a special type of winter tire because of the bolt pattern" makes no sense. A special type of tire? because of bolt pattern? what "type" of tire would that be? Mid-grade :D ? Again, makes no sense as originally posted.

Additionally, you posted that GM didn't design our wheels for winter use - Last time I checked, GM engineers were in DETROIT, and are quite familiar with winter, which is why each wheel is painted (except for the polished 18" GTP wheel) or chromed. Yes, it would be great to hop out and pick up an extra set of wheels and tires for winter, but not everyone is willing to do that, it may not be worth it to them, saving the stock wheels like that.

The problem with your first post, for the most part, was the lack of clarification - the supposed "in the business" speak. Next time take the time to speak in layman's terms with clarification.

miscreant

11-25-2005, 06:13 PM

Thanks for the 'info'
lol. :cheers:

otcpharm

11-27-2005, 11:36 AM

Well, maybe it's some lingo from canada, but I was "in the business" and to some extent still am, and never heard bridgestones called 'bridges' and also never defined a level of tire as 'mid grade' - there's mid-grade gas, yes...So perhaps it would have been better to write it in layman's terms for people who "aren't in the business" as probably most who read this aren't.

Also, I guess you could say that the bolt pattern reduces the amount of selection of winter wheels you can find, and subsequently limits the tire sizes that appropriately fit on those wheels, which subsequently limits the tire selection for winter. But just saying "Your G6 GTP and others require a special type of winter tire because of the bolt pattern" makes no sense. A special type of tire? because of bolt pattern? what "type" of tire would that be? Mid-grade :D ? Again, makes no sense as originally posted.

Additionally, you posted that GM didn't design our wheels for winter use - Last time I checked, GM engineers were in DETROIT, and are quite familiar with winter, which is why each wheel is painted (except for the polished 18" GTP wheel) or chromed. Yes, it would be great to hop out and pick up an extra set of wheels and tires for winter, but not everyone is willing to do that, it may not be worth it to them, saving the stock wheels like that.

The problem with your first post, for the most part, was the lack of clarification - the supposed "in the business" speak. Next time take the time to speak in layman's terms with clarification.

I like your style.

I really like your tag line.

Smiles

11-30-2005, 09:31 AM

S8ER99

11-30-2005, 09:57 AM

No... you are not speaking clearly enough. We understand these are not 360 Triple A Z rated tires .. not a problem. Mid grade? Sure...

The tire itself will fit on any 16 inch rim provided its for a 16 inch tire ..regardless of bolt pattern.

miscreant

11-30-2005, 10:14 AM

We can debate about this for hours miscreant, but unfortunately I dont have the time! If you can't understand what I am saying thats to bad cause you missing out. Esspecially if you dont understand what med. grade tires are....if you were in the business at all you WOULD know what that is! Also having limited selection of tires because of bolt patterns means you will have to buy only a certain wheel because there arent many available meaning they will be a special purchase! Therefore that is what I meant by a special winter tire! Good enough clarification?? Or should I elaborate more? Or maybe use only one syllables word for you? If that makes it easier I can.......I know you can make out what I have said in my first post now that youve proally read it a few times and things are starting to make sense.....try using the old brain its there for a reason or maybe research what I am talking about insteading of trying to put me down! Its not apprecaited at all......is that how you get a boost in self esteem? put ppl down? try to make the new guy to the forum look bad?

SmilesSmiles, whose resorting to insults now? Not once did I directly insult you with such items as the bolded areas above. I simply was pointing out inaccuracies in your first post, which still stand. I never attacked you personally, only your posts.

In the first post you said they would need a special TYPE of tire. There's not special TYPE of tire needed. There "may" be a special size of tire needed (read below though), but certainly not a special TYPE of winter tire.

Secondly, regardless of what the bolt pattern is, it does not limit the winter tire selection. The problem is finding the WHEELS, once the WHEELS are found, there are PLENTY of tires in the sizes needed. Wheels are only 16" or 17", or 18", etc. There are TONS of tires for 16" and 17" wheels, and plenty for 18". The bolt pattern of the wheel means nothing as to what tires will then mount on them - only wheel diameter and wheel width matter. So to say that the bolt pattern limits the TYPE, SIZE, or AVAILABILITY of tires is not true. If you find 16" wheels, then you can put 16" tires on it (225/60R16 or 215/65R16 for GTP, which are two of the most POPULAR tire sizes around), of any kind you want. If you can find 17" wheels, then you can put 17" tires on it, etc. So the bolt pattern limits the wheels you can find, NOT the tires.

Mid grade, well to each his own. I'm sure you can call anything product-wise as mid grade or low grade or high grade, but since tires have specific purposes, mid grade doesn't describe the ability or performance of a tire. What is a "mid grade" tire? Good wear? Good wet performance? Good dry performance? H speed rated? The term "mid-grade" does not impart any information as to what the tire actually is. Now making a comment like a good "mid-grade" touring tire, or good "mid-grade" passenger tire, or good "mid-grade" performance tire, well, that gives a little more information, but the information it gives is mostly imparted by the tire's use-descriptor, and not the "mid-grade" part, since one person's "mid-grade" may be another person's low grade.

So you can continue to make personal insults, that is fine. But your initial post didn't make sense and was inaccurate, which to someone with limited knowledge, it helps little. I can just see someone walking into the local Goodyear and saying "I read on the internet that my bolt pattern is weird, so do you have the special type of winter tire I need?" - The guy behind the counter would be like "what???" and then that person would say "well I need some mid-grade tires" and the guy behind the counter would be like..."Well, what kind of tire do you need, winter or all-season or performance, or do you want one with long treadlife or one with good dry performance? Mid-grade doesn't tell me much at all..."

miscreant

11-30-2005, 10:15 AM

Hambone

11-30-2005, 11:15 AM

My tires must be bad on my Grand Am. They are goodyear 14X32 and sometimes they will spin on a poorly prepped race track under full throttle, let alone the rain.

Robyn P

11-30-2005, 11:23 AM

"Real men wear Pink? No - real men (and women) wear camoflage, sleep in ditches dug in the sand, eat MREs, and carry US issued weapons..."

Miscreant,
Are you in the military? You seem to have military approach when typing. Not meaning it in a bad way, you seem just very stern in your typing. You also seem to know a whole lot more than the rest of us, which is not a bad thing, considering if I went in to buy tires I would have no clue what I needed, other than tires. :p Always remember different people take things different ways, what may not offend you or me, may offend someone else. :)

miscreant

11-30-2005, 11:36 AM

Robyn P

11-30-2005, 11:47 AM

Yes, previous service. 3rd Combat Comm, USAF, and 179th Airlift Wing, OHANG.

I have a friend that is currently in the USAF.

S8ER99

11-30-2005, 12:06 PM

My tires must be bad on my Grand Am. They are goodyear 14X32 and sometimes they will spin on a poorly prepped race track under full throttle, let alone the rain.
haha.. gee...wonder why. I am willing to bet you don't go cruising in the rain much ;)

rwbooth

11-30-2005, 02:08 PM

miscreant and smiles,

I think you both need a hug.

Robyn P

11-30-2005, 02:34 PM

miscreant and smiles,

I think you both need a hug.

Amen!! :D

miscreant

11-30-2005, 04:21 PM

Amen!! :D
:banana: where's my hug?!?!?! :banana:

Smiles

11-30-2005, 06:04 PM

I am trying to be friendly here, but my first post got ripped apart! Torn into little pieces! And what did I do....nothing but try and help! Now I am tied up in this arguement that I dont want to be in about not clarifing what I meant! Geezzz, when no one but miscreant commented on my post because he couldnt understand it.....I would have just appreciated a PM instead of ripping it up infront of everyone....if you have any questions about my lingo a PM is just a click away.....if you have any questions on where I get a my information on wheels a PM is just a click away and I can reference it all......and I am sure I can learn just as much from you guys as you can from me.....lastly I admit the posts are vague, but I thought everyone here being car guys/girls you may understand.......

Smiles

Special meaning limited availablility....I know a 16" is a 16"......a bolt pattern is a bolt pattern....its just limited selection here in the forest city (this is a fact...meaning you can only purchase them in specific locations e.g. a gm dealership) I think thats pretty specail....

Wannahavegtpcoupe

11-30-2005, 06:27 PM

miscreant

11-30-2005, 06:39 PM

Special meaning limited availablility....I know a 16" is a 16"......a bolt pattern is a bolt pattern....its just limited selection here in the forest city (this is a fact...meaning you can only purchase them in specific locations e.g. a gm dealership) I think thats pretty specail....
I'm not trying to rip you, I'm only pointing out inaccuracies.

So you can only purchase tires or wheels at a GM dealership in the forest city? Again, I'm not sure what you are complaining about, the wheels or the tires? If you can purchase a 16" wheel (which I believe we have determined will not fit on the GT/GTP), then you can purchase any 16" tire. Any Bridgestone, Michelin, Kuhmo, Nitto, Pirelli, Goodyear, etc will fit on a 16" wheel. Now if you are saying the wheels are special, then yes, the 5x110mm bolt pattern does limit wheels, but you said special "tires" not special wheels...

Now if for some reason you don't have any tire stores in forest city other than a GM dealership, then that's fine, but that's not the way it is in the US or most places - heck, you have the internet, so you don't even need anyone around you except a road for UPS to drive up to your house and drop stuff off to.

miscreant

11-30-2005, 06:41 PM

I have 18 inch eagle LS tires on my GTP and find they don't have as much traction in snow as I would like. Anybody that has already switched to snow tires and steel rims that could post the info on what they bought would be appreciated. On the weekend I tried to climb a small snow covered hill (5 inches of snow) to get out of a driveway and for a while I thought I might not make it as the car started to slide sideways on the front end. I realize that the rims will not be 18 inch rims.
You'll need 17" wheels at minimum from what we have determined so far.

Tirerack has some 17" wheels for under $100 each, and you can have some 17" Winterforce snows (225/55R17 @ $79) mounted on them for winter.

built4drivers

12-01-2005, 01:09 PM

Hi all,

I was just reading some postings about peak torque. The torque band on GM engines is pretty flat and it does hit within 90% of peak at low RPM's. There's a great resource to find out about GM Powertrain stuff and the website is www.gmpowertrain.com.

Click on a GM engine or transmission brand (IE Ecotec), then "Product Information", Car Engines and Transmissions and it will give you a list of all GM brands and the applicable GM Powertrain applications. You can get pictures, power plots, technical specifications and model-year specific changes to each engine and transmission that GM makes. Pictures are generally specific to each vehicle application as well.

Link to 3.5L Power Plot:
http://media.gm.com/us/powertrain/en/product_services/HPT%20Library/HVV6/2006_35L_LX9_2DrNB.pdf

Link to 3.9L Power Plot:
http://media.gm.com/us/powertrain/en/product_services/HPT%20Library/HVV6/2006_39L_LZ9_G6_2DrNB.pdf

Link to 2.4L Power Plot:
http://media.gm.com/us/powertrain/en/product_services/HPT%20Library/Ecotec/2006_Ecotec_LE5_Pontiac_G6.pdf

S8ER99

12-01-2005, 03:17 PM

Yes but those curves are crank numbers from the engine. Another words in the real world once TM, throttle by wire, and the slushbox get done doing their job that dyno chart would look a little different. ;)

Kman

12-01-2005, 04:56 PM

miscreant

12-01-2005, 05:31 PM

I will leave these tires on for the winter.You're very brave. The RE050As absolutely suck in winter. It will be like driving on slicks, just FYI.

S8ER99

12-01-2005, 06:28 PM

My car came with the 'W' rated Bridgestone Potenza RE050A's. If you put the power down hard, they will slip a liittle on a wet surface. The 3.9L has gobs of low end torque and I found it has a good amount near the top end also. I will leave these tires on for the winter. Hopefully, this Winter won't be so bad. :)

You don't have to worry about 'top end' power until you can bark 2nd~3rd gear in an automatic at 79mph. haha.. (obviously if anyone out there is making more than 400hp you know what I am talking)

Kman

12-01-2005, 07:54 PM

You're very brave. The RE050As absolutely suck in winter. It will be like driving on slicks, just FYI.I live right off a major road that is always plowed early. It should be interesting though.

miscreant

12-01-2005, 07:57 PM

I live right off a major road that is always plowed early. It should be interesting though.
Keep in mind that one of the main reasons it sucks is the cold weather/temps makes the tire very slippery, even without snow. Below 45-50 degree, "summer only" tires start to get real slippery.

Kman

12-01-2005, 07:59 PM

You don't have to worry about 'top end' power until you can bark 2nd~3rd gear in an automatic at 79mph. haha.. (obviously if anyone out there is making more than 400hp you know what I am talking)Well, I know my GTP is no 'Hot Rod' and I do know what 400 HP feels like. I test drove an '05 Vette at the 'AutoShow In Motion' last year. That was 'press your head into the headrest fast'! That was a some RUSH!!

S8ER99

12-02-2005, 06:43 AM

hehe.. yes.. very incredible feeling. I always described it as having the skin on your face start to pull back. :)

I know a fellow racer on this board (harbone I believe :) ) knows exactly what I mean and much more ;) When you get into a 500+ HP car (or dipping into sub 10 seconds) it gets even crazier. :)

Smiles

12-02-2005, 08:16 AM

Hey miscreant a pm is just a click away if you have any questions on what I meant that way you are just wasting space for ppl that have "real" posts.....inaccuracies or things you just dont understand?? PM away buddy......cause I have dont have time to be ripped on or under your understanding having all my inaccuracies pointed out. PM away.....

Smiles

Smiles

12-10-2005, 10:23 AM

No pm's yet....thought that might happen

miscreant

12-10-2005, 02:21 PM

No pm's yet....thought that might happen
:D :p ...... :rolleyes:

G6Action

12-10-2005, 09:27 PM

:D :p ...... :rolleyes:

:bash: now BOYS......if you can't play nicely, you will both be sent to the corner for a 'TIME OUT'!

but for now, both of you 'GO TO YOUR ROOMS' and NO DINNER for either of you! and NO, you can't watch South Park either!!!!

papaw

miscreant

12-11-2005, 09:30 AM

:bash: now BOYS......if you can't play nicely, you will both be sent to the corner for a 'TIME OUT'!

but for now, both of you 'GO TO YOUR ROOMS' and NO DINNER for either of you! and NO, you can't watch South Park either!!!!

papaw
:( Ah, man...

FWIW, I only give smileys to those that are too childish to take criticism...

Smiles

12-12-2005, 01:08 PM

Cristism is only said by childish ppl.......unless its constructive.....which this wasnt.....

miscreant

12-12-2005, 01:24 PM

Cristism is only said by childish ppl.......unless its constructive.....which this wasnt.....
It was constructive to everyone else. Now they know they don't need special winter tires because of the bolt pattern on their G6. They need special wheels perhaps, but not special tires. They also got to see clarified that mid-grade bridges were actually tires, not medium priced ways of traveling over water, or special attactments for tires, or items that help align their teeth (just kidding).

Even you said "people in the business would know what that (mid-grade bridges) means" - but last time I checked most of the people here weren't "in the business".

The only reason I even posted was because you were trying to tell people that their wheels weren't designed for winter, the Smiles-slang "mid-grade bridges" thing, and the comment about needing special tires.

But you won't answer my questions, so it's rather redundant to keep this thing going with me - have you not noticed it's been left behind up until you "returned" recently?

So if you really want to prove your point (in case you haven't noticed, I'm actually trying to have a civil debate here), rather than hurl countless, meaningless, and pointless pokes, answer those questions:

How are the wheels not "designed" for winter?
What special tires are needed for the 5x110 bolt pattern?

G6Action

12-12-2005, 04:39 PM

:D :p ...... :rolleyes:

do you think the name "smiles" is kinda like calling a really tall guy 'shorty' or a bald guy 'curly'??????? hey, at one time everyone thought that i was a little 'pink pig' with a goatee!!!

"smiles" needs to understand that if you post it 'publicly', then you become fair game to be criticized 'publicly', RIGHT? at least thats the way I play the game. :rolleyes:

G6Action

12-12-2005, 04:49 PM

They also got to see clarified that mid-grade bridges were actually tires, not medium priced ways of traveling over water, or special attactments for tires, or items that help align their teeth
(just kidding).

you mean, they're NOT? ha ha

actually, i've been in 'the business' (automotive dealership parts and service) for over 25 years and have NEVER heard a term like a 'mid-grade bridge' unless thats 'tire store' lingo for a medium-grade Bridgestone tire. if that were the case, you could have 'mid-grade goods', 'high-grade fires', lo-grade pots', and even a 'no-grade yoko', but the last one may offend fans of Mrs. Lennon. :rolleyes:

S8ER99

12-12-2005, 05:29 PM

LMAO @ the lennon joke!

Smiles

12-13-2005, 08:11 AM

miscreant

12-13-2005, 09:21 AM

More criticism.....did you guys (misreant and G6action) not read my earlier posts? if you have any question on this stuff feel free to pm me instead of "trying" to criticsize me in public....you draggin on a thread about tires because you feel like criticsizing someone about things you dont understand.....so for the 3rd time a pm is just a click.....step up to the plate boys i wont bite if you send me a pm....

P.S. Constructive means that you are building on something I said hence the construct part of constructive and no you didnt build on what I said at all you tore it down....and down and down some more.....
Why should anyone PM you - so it's not public anymore? Was your initial post a PM? No. The point of this continued conversation is for public benefit. It's not longer criticism from me, I simply asked you two questions for the benefit of enhancing your original post, but you can't answer them.

Constructive criticism is criticism that is useful by the person receiving the criticism to create a new ideal or concept. The root of constructive is "construct" which in this meaning is "A concept, model, or idea".

G6Action

12-13-2005, 09:56 AM

Why should anyone PM you - so it's not public anymore? Was your initial post a PM? No. The point of this continued conversation is for public benefit. It's not longer criticism from me, I simply asked you two questions for the benefit of enhancing your original post, but you can't answer them.

Constructive criticism is criticism that is useful by the person receiving the criticism to create a new ideal or concept. The root of constructive is "construct" which in this meaning is "A concept, model, or idea".

DITTO! :banana:

S8ER99

12-13-2005, 02:55 PM

:mad:

Smiles

12-13-2005, 02:58 PM

You can pm me so that people that have real posts about tires can do that....now you've just put up another 2 posts that no one cares to read.....because they arent about tires.....and thats the title of the post......TIRES.....not "criticisms r us" by G6 Action and Miscreant....if you want to start a post like that go ahead.....that way ppl dont have to read your BS....I have already had a few ppl pm about you and your actions on the forum and how they arent pleased with how you are responding to what I wrote originally so taking it upon myself I have asked you to pm if you have any problems so that everyone else doesnt have to hear your ranting.....I am always looking out for everyones interest here and not just my own.
As far as you googling what constructive criticism is thats great! As far as you not getting the answer you are looking for to bad....if you want the answer feel free to pm me....like I have asked you to do 4 times now, but if you cant thats fine I understand.....some people just like to act rude on forums and try to make members look bad.....being a member of multiply forums I have seen it 1,000000 times and I guess I was just the unlucky one to run into the wrong person who just gets pleasure by knocking others....as far as your criticism I apprecaite you trying to help, but because I dont see it as constructive at all it isnt building on what I said or constructing a new ideal model or concept hence it isnt constructive for me so I have learned nothing from it....but thanks for the effort I always aprreciate ppl that try and help me. As far as this thread goes I am finished with it so if anyone has any further questions feel free to send me a pm and I will get back to you promptly. Now let hear some more on Tires....

To my best friends G6Action and Miscreant....."I say good day" (Fez)

S8ER99

12-13-2005, 03:47 PM

Wow..honestly you clutter the thread up with more posts about 'PM's than you actually did tire info. Way to contribute.

G6Action

12-13-2005, 04:37 PM

Wow..honestly you clutter the thread up with more posts about 'PM's than you actually did tire info. Way to contribute.

DOUBLE DITTO!!! :D

otcpharm

12-13-2005, 04:40 PM

I have seen it 1,000000 times

How many IS that, anyway? The schools here in the states teach us the proper use of separators for our numbers.

To my best friends G6Action and Miscreant....."I say good day" (Fez)

Smiles, "You Di*K!" (Jeff Spicoli)

G6Action

12-13-2005, 04:47 PM

ok, i actually have some 'feedback' on TIRES!!!! not PM'S, TIRES!!!!

its been about a week now and my Continentals really haven't done that bad. i am surprised and somewhat relieved. i had gone to the Tire Rack website and checked the 'stats' for several tires. the Continentals really didn't fair too well. michelin was at the top of the chart with a price tag of about $140.00 ea. but second was MY PERSONAL FAVORITE, the Yokohama Avid at $94.00 ea (approx)

seems this tire was a MUCH BETTER buy than the Michelin for the money and was head over heals above what i have now. so my plan now is to keep the Continentals until next spring/summer and move up to the Yokohamas.

again, for what it's worth, just my personal choice that i thought i would share with all of you.

p.s. if 'smiles' is so concerned about using up space, why doesn't HE do what he preaches and use PM's???? again, just a thought :rolleyes:

G6Action

12-13-2005, 04:49 PM

How many IS that, anyway? The schools here in the states teach us the proper use of separators for our numbers.

Smiles, "You Di*K!" (Jeff Spicoli)

hey, i don't know you from adam, but i luv ya, man!!! LMAO

G6Action

12-13-2005, 04:56 PM

S8ER99

12-13-2005, 05:31 PM

seems this tire was a MUCH BETTER buy than the Michelin for the money and was head over heals above what i have now. so my plan now is to keep the Continentals until next spring/summer and move up to the Yokohamas.

The Mid-Conts (ha ha) will be good enough to survive winter until you decide to upgrade so thats probably a good idea. I am sure by the time spring rolls around again the Yokos you looked at will have been replaced with something better at the same price level so its always worth the extra wait. :)

miscreant

12-13-2005, 11:50 PM

Robyn P

12-14-2005, 06:33 AM

its been about a week now and my Continentals really haven't done that bad.

Thanks for posting this. It makes me feel better, especially knowing the weather where you are gets worse than the weather down here. I now know I should be ok when it finally does snow. :)

Smiles

12-14-2005, 08:43 AM

Heres some feedback....my friend who also drives a 06 G6 GTP with the 6 Speed has been riding around in second gear so far since we got snow about 3 weeks ago. Killer on gas mileage and hard on the car so I was finally able to get him a good deal on some tires....got him some 16" mid-grade bridges....yeah I know you understand what that means now! hahaha....he says that he has no trouble driving now.....his summer wheels are the 18" Ultra's with mudd and snow tires on them, but they just dont cut it for this time of year. He agreed with me that you should preserve your stock wheels and not put them through Canada's winters......wow a post about tires omg!

S8ER99

12-14-2005, 08:47 AM

I live on the mississippi *we have 2 bridges*.. I have known the term 'mid grade' bridge all my life. Still doesn't have anything to do with tires. :p

Smiles

12-15-2005, 07:51 AM

I guess S8er99 everything you say goes? So just because you say it doesnt have anything to do with tires means the parts department that is sitting 20 feet away from me right now must be talking bs too.....hhmmmm I am going to have to go with the parts dept. on this sorry man, thanks for posting something that has to do with tires.....

Heres a good tip.....this again having to do with tires and helping others....which this thread is for.....if you are getting any snow build up on you wheel wells trying apply alittle grease to it...not alot but I alittle will help the snow slide right off because we all know winter tires with their deep tread can propel a lot of snow....

S8ER99

12-15-2005, 02:45 PM

G6Action

12-15-2005, 07:34 PM

Smiles

12-17-2005, 08:08 AM

Yeah.. um.. Seriously you have to understand that each company has its own lingo right?? Just becuase something is done or said one way in your little world..doesn't mean it applies to the rest of the world. Being from Canada I would have assumed you figured that out by now. Hell my cousins call a water fountain a bubbler. Doesn't mean everyone does. Right?

I am trying to get you to grasp reality... not that you are wrong... but that you are trying to speak lingo that is not universal. Welcome to the rest of the world man.

As far as applying grease to the wheel wells... um.. Driven thru the last 10 winters and NEVER had a problem with that.. so thanks for the tip..but not worth the effort.

I couldnt agree with you more man.....the problem was your post b4 that.....you made a stand in saying that, "still doesnt have anything to do with tires" and then you contridicted yourself by saying every place has their own lingo meaning that it does have to do with tires just not in your world as you so nicely put it. Dont make a stand about something if you are going to immediately change what you are implying....my grade 12 acient history teacher taught me that if you make a stand about something back it up or dont make a stand at all....so were you wrong to put that my lingo has nothing to with tires? Because its used for tires all the time...you dont have to answer this if you dont want because we all know whats what here....

Anyways trying to stay on topic here.....something else about tires....uumm did you know that not only does you G6 have available traction assist, but you can also get an enhanced TC system. This reduces wheel torque causing you to spin "The Tire" less making it grip better on those greasey surfaces. Some people have the understanding that TC just sends power to the tire that is gripping and reducing power to the one that is slipping.
Have you tried applying grease? dont knock it until you try it....man why are ppl so stubborn to others throwing suggestions out there? is that not what this site is for? Ive never ran into so many ignorant ppl on forum until i joined this one....

G6Action

12-17-2005, 10:28 AM

I couldnt agree with you more man.....the problem was your post b4 that.....you made a stand in saying that, "still doesnt have anything to do with tires" and then you contridicted yourself by saying every place has their own lingo meaning that it does have to do with tires just not in your world as you so nicely put it. Dont make a stand about something if you are going to immediately change what you are implying....my grade 12 acient history teacher taught me that if you make a stand about something back it up or dont make a stand at all....so were you wrong to put that my lingo has nothing to with tires? Because its used for tires all the time...you dont have to answer this if you dont want because we all know whats what here....

Anyways trying to stay on topic here.....something else about tires....uumm did you know that not only does you G6 have available traction assist, but you can also get an enhanced TC system. This reduces wheel torque causing you to spin "The Tire" less making it grip better on those greasey surfaces. Some people have the understanding that TC just sends power to the tire that is gripping and reducing power to the one that is slipping.
Have you tried applying grease? dont knock it until you try it....man why are ppl so stubborn to others throwing suggestions out there? is that not what this site is for? Ive never ran into so many ignorant ppl on forum until i joined this one....

maybe, just maybe, they don't like to be refered to as 'ignorant', ya think?

and besides, what ever happened to your 'suggestion' that people use 'PM's' and not waste this space? if you don't even use your own 'suggestions', why would you think that a bunch of 'ignorant ppl' would? :agree2:

G6Action

12-18-2005, 10:07 AM

New to the forum....Hello to you all,

Just a heads up on tires.....GM did not design there 17" Chromies, 17" Aluminum Painted, 18" Aluminum and 18" Ultras wheels for winter use.....lets not forget about stone chips an scratches from sand and salt save those rims! I hope this helps. Smiles

sorry, don't mean to 'beat a dead horse' (ever hear that saying in Canada? if not, i will gladly explain it to you) but i can't for the life of me believe that GM spent probably BILLIONS of DOLLARS in research, design and construction on any vehicle without taking into consideration the effects that winter weather (including road salt, sand, etc) would have on their WHEELS! if we still need to protect our wheels by replacing them for winter, then why stop there? what about the fenders? in most cases they are still constructed of steel and steel will get stone chips and scratches from sand and salt just like the wheels? AND being of steel construction, they WILL RUST once chipped or scratched. maybe we should go purchase a spare set of fenders, have them 'RHINO-LINED' and put them on for 'winter use' also? since we are on the subject of sheetmetal, how about the hood as well? lets buy a spare hood and "Rhino-Line" it also!!! and even if they're not steel but aluminum, they can still get scratched, dinged and dented. hey, never have to worry about a scratched hood or fender any more......RIGHT? well, guess what, WRONG!!! stuff can and will happen all year long to our vehicles. if we all could afford it (and some of us can) we would just put our G6's away for the winter and drive an old, V8 4x4 that gets 8 MPG.

your suggestion to 'swap wheels' for the winter is a good one, but don't state for a fact (which is EXACTLY what you did) that GM used poor judgement in R&D (reasearch and development) as an excuse to use other wheels. its simply a personal choice and you are NOT the first person to ever think of it. DUH!!! :D

G6Action

12-18-2005, 10:24 AM

Ive never ran into so many ignorant ppl on forum until i joined this one....

.....and just one more 'thing'.....why did YOU join this forum anyway? i see you don't even OWN a G6? you've got some sort of Pontiac 'wanna-be' car.

while it is true that there are several people on this forum that do NOT own G6's. they at least have the common decency to refrain from calling those of us who DO own G6's 'idiot ppl'......is there a 'pursuit owners club' forum? if so, i think i will join and and do the same to YOU.......how would you like THAT?

same difference, man. you're on OUR "Home Turf" here, so maybe you should be a little more 'discreet' when posting. remember, YOU are in the MINORITY!!!

sorry for ranting and raving, fellow members.....its just that i woke up this a.m. and on my calendar it said "diss 'smiles' day", so i did. oh, wait a minute, it says that on EVERY DAY!!!! man, am i ever gonna be busy!!!! :eek:

The Oracle

12-18-2005, 12:14 PM

[...] dont knock it until you try it....man why are ppl so stubborn to others throwing suggestions out there? is that not what this site is for? Ive never ran into so many ignorant ppl on forum until i joined this one....
Interesting the things one encounters when they look in on a thread to see what's been discussed. I don't normally add to a thread that I have not participated in, but I will make this one "guest" appearance. We apparently have a member of the "THREAD POLICE" in our midst.

On the one hand, when "Smiles" mentioned not to knock it until you tried it -- someone please tell the rest of us in that ONE posting, who was able to knock the suggestion prior to Smiles having "dissed" the group as a whole? Answer: NOBODY!

This site IS for expressing one's thoughts with the other members on topics that we are either ALL familiar with OR are all learning about. "Smiles"..., who appointed you Judge, jury & executioner ALL-IN-ONE???

Give this post a 2nd read & think about what you've said to others before convicting us all of a fault that no one has committed.

~Bye all...

G6Action

12-18-2005, 09:12 PM

Interesting the things one encounters when they look in on a thread to see what's been discussed. I don't normally add to a thread that I have not participated in, but I will make this one "guest" appearance. We apparently have a member of the "THREAD POLICE" in our midst.

On the one hand, when "Smiles" mentioned not to knock it until you tried it -- someone please tell the rest of us in that ONE posting, who was able to knock the suggestion prior to Smiles having "dissed" the group as a whole? Answer: NOBODY!

This site IS for expressing one's thoughts with the other members on topics that we are either ALL familiar with OR are all learning about. "Smiles"..., who appointed you Judge, jury & executioner ALL-IN-ONE???

Give this post a 2nd read & think about what you've said to others before convicting us all of a fault that no one has committed.

~Bye all...

thank you! :)

S8ER99

12-19-2005, 06:34 AM

I couldnt agree with you more man.....the problem was your post b4 that.....you made a stand in saying that, "still doesnt have anything to do with tires" and then you contridicted yourself by saying every place has their own lingo meaning that it does have to do with tires just not in your world as you so nicely put it.

Well technically both statements are accurant. If your lingo means nothing to the rest of the world..then its safe to say it has nothing to do with tires and something to do with where you work. If it did have something to do with 'tires' the second you said it EVERYONE would have understood you.

Anyways trying to stay on topic here.....something else about tires....uumm did you know that not only does you G6 have available traction assist, but you can also get an enhanced TC system. This reduces wheel torque causing you to spin "The Tire" less making it grip better on those greasey surfaces. Some people have the understanding that TC just sends power to the tire that is gripping and reducing power to the one that is slipping.

Doesn't really matter what this feature does..because I DO NOT have it. So mine DOES NOT HAVE available traction assist.

Have you tried applying grease? dont knock it until you try it....man why are ppl so stubborn to others throwing suggestions out there? is that not what this site is for? Ive never ran into so many ignorant ppl on forum until i joined this one....
I am not stubborn to your suggestion...I am telling you it is not necessary for me to apply grease when I don't have any issues of snow building up to begin with. Like apply preperation H to my ass when I don't have a problem. Know what I mean?

Don't worry I will continue to deal with my ignorance.. Its done me just fine in life so far. As soon as I manage to get rid of this G6 i am driving I can go back to dealing with the narrowminded views of the Camaro and mustang owners again. They seemed to provide much more useful information even when they were being *******s. You on the other hand....

G6Action

12-19-2005, 09:57 AM

I am not stubborn to your suggestion...I am telling you it is not necessary for me to apply grease when I don't have any issues of snow building up to begin with. Like apply preperation H to my ass when I don't have a problem. Know what I mean?

QUESTION: will applying Preparation H to my ass help reduce "Snow Build-up"
when sledding? or, as 'smiles' has suggested, should i use grease as he does on his CAR (or whatever that thing is he drives)? if i should use the grease, what do you (smiles) recommend? 80-90w? some sort of synthetic lube? or just good old KY Jelly?

UPDATE: nevermind....i just decided to wear Jeans and that has solved the problem.

thanks anyway, guys!!!! :D

Smiles

12-19-2005, 10:37 AM

There you go again making a stand.....my statement means nothing to the rest of the world....if I went into any tire shop and asked if they carried mid-grade tires more they likely know what I mean. So you cant make that stand saying that no one else in the world would know what it means...the whole world? Be reasonable. Another stand is that everyone would know what it is? Wow how wrong could that be....you dont think there are ppl on these forums that dont know a spark plug from cigarette lighter? So you are saying that everyone has to understand everything that I am saying or it has nothing to do with a particular topic? Wow again be reasonable.
And its great you dont have that feature, but other ppl do! So there's no reason for you to say what you did.....you were obviously upset at the time, hence your bold lettering, but hey I forgive you.....
Again the grease was just a suggestion....I wasnt ordering you to do it....you can take it either way, but again these forums are open to public input so if you dont want to do it im not going to force you too.....so again theres no reason for you to say what did about my suggestion....

Anyways I am done dealing with you on this.....its seems that I am constantly being judged by a jury and am having all my posts continually being executed here. Thats right Oracle I am the one on trial here and have been since the beginning of my membership with G6Owners Club....haha but I am not complaining....I have always liked hearing other peoples views....heck I am learning a lot from this!

Robyn P

12-19-2005, 11:48 AM

you dont think there are ppl on these forums that dont know a spark plug from cigarette lighter?

Smiles,
I have not commented about any of your posts, so when you take it upon yourself to point fingers at all of us, needless to say people will get upset. You have been very disrespectful to us all. "Ive never ran into so many ignorant ppl on forum until i joined this one:" 3 people had responded to you for the most part out of over 300. 3 out of 300 is not very many. Yes I realize others have made comments here and there, but you're main issues seems to be with 3 people, 2 presently. So you had no right making the above comment in red. As for your above quote, please, next time you want to make a comparison come up with something a little more clever than a spark plug and a cigarette lighter. The majority of us on here are pretty smart. If you don't like us, then stop coming here. And if you choose to stay, then be more personable. :)

S8ER99

12-19-2005, 12:10 PM

There you go again making a stand.....my statement means nothing to the rest of the world....if I went into any tire shop and asked if they carried mid-grade tires more they likely know what I mean.

Ahh..but you didn't say mid grade tires..you said mid grade BRIDGES. ;) Also mid grade can mean something different to everyone. Mid grade gas at Amoco is 89 Octane... midgrade at BP is 91. ;)

And its great you dont have that feature, but other ppl do! So there's no reason for you to say what you did.....you were obviously upset at the time, hence your bold lettering, but hey I forgive you.....

Irony at its finest.. if you reread you did not address ONE person who you KNEW had that option. You literally said "uumm did you know that not only does you G6 have available traction assist, but you can also get an enhanced TC system." By available is would be easily presumed you meant 'the G6 has it.. and its available to you'. So in context..No my G6 does not have this available. If you were addressing a certain individual..then my mistake... please..who was it?

Again the grease was just a suggestion....I wasnt ordering you to do it....you can take it either way, but again these forums are open to public input so if you dont want to do it im not going to force you too.....so again theres no reason for you to say what did about my suggestion....
I simply told you why this would be a waste of time for ME. By retorting and defending your suggestion you are in fact implying demand.

Anyways I am done dealing with you on this.....its seems that I am constantly being judged by a jury and am having all my posts continually being executed here. Thats right Oracle I am the one on trial here and have been since the beginning of my membership with G6Owners Club....haha but I am not complaining....I have always liked hearing other peoples views....heck I am learning a lot from this!
The know it all essence you posted with from day 1 is the very reason you are having such a hard time here. If you were familiar with the IT world what so ever so you know programmers are among the most difficult people in the world to deal with. Want to know why? Logic. Logical thinking is something people have a hard time grasping. You seem to be among them. You offered advice and told you it was pointless and WHY it was pointless for me. Yet you tried to act like I said your idea was a sure deal and I am the bad guy for shooting it down.

The mid grade bridge deal... in essense I suppose you are correct the lingo you are spewing forth might apply at tire shops acrossed the world. Of course in its broad generalization I still feel that it has little to nothing to do with tires.... No more than a mid grade video card, Mid grade processor, sound card, etc has to do with IT. The part of what you said that I absolutely refute is that the common world calls bridgestone tires 'bridges' as implied by "mid grade bridges"

As you should know bridges exist ON the tire physically so to call a tire brand by the name 'bridge' would be utterly confusing as well as pointless. I guess thats probably how it works up north aye?

rwbooth

12-19-2005, 03:08 PM

S8ER99,

Why don't you just let it go? Does anyone really care about the term "bridges." Who gives a rats ass.

AND,
Don't say "I guess thats probably how it works up north aye." It just proves your ignorance.

Let it go, and keep your comments about "the north" to yourself.

otcpharm

12-19-2005, 08:29 PM

S8ER99,
Don't say "I guess thats probably how it works up north aye." It just proves your ignorance.

Yeah, you should know that it's properly: "I guess that's how it works up north, eh?" :D

"Aye" is a sailor's affirmative response to the XO.

S8ER99

12-19-2005, 09:09 PM

ahahaha.. yeah.. letting it go. Don't want to piss off anyone up north or anything.

Smiles

12-21-2005, 10:59 AM

Smiles,
I have not commented about any of your posts, so when you take it upon yourself to point fingers at all of us, needless to say people will get upset. You have been very disrespectful to us all. "Ive never ran into so many ignorant ppl on forum until i joined this one:" 3 people had responded to you for the most part out of over 300. 3 out of 300 is not very many. Yes I realize others have made comments here and there, but you're main issues seems to be with 3 people, 2 presently. So you had no right making the above comment in red. As for your above quote, please, next time you want to make a comparison come up with something a little more clever than a spark plug and a cigarette lighter. The majority of us on here are pretty smart. If you don't like us, then stop coming here. And if you choose to stay, then be more personable. :)

Well I am sorry if you felt that the above statement was directed towards you Robyn. This was not directed towards anyone but those 3 ppl. It didnt say that it was directed at every member. I am not lying when I said what I have said. Being a member of mulitple forums I have never been treated like this for making public suggestions. So there is truth behind what I have said so I had a right to make the comment I did. Now you are judging me on my comparision....you have "no right" to do that. Having a career in the automotive industry myself I know lots of people that dont know what those things are so I made it as clear as possible when I did that comparsion to avoid another "mid-grade bridges" debate. Which I am sure you have already read about....if not it's all above. I know the majority of you are pretty smart, but I cant leave out the ones who arent up to your level of intelligence...I am trying not to discriminate here. I like it here because I have a passion for cars....and dont tell to be a certain way....you have "no right" all I have done is try to be helpful, but have ended up defending myself for almost every post I have ever posted.

Smiles

Robyn P

12-21-2005, 12:01 PM

Well I am sorry if you felt that the above statement was directed towards you Robyn. This was not directed towards anyone but those 3 ppl. It didnt say that it was directed at every member. I am not lying when I said what I have said. Being a member of mulitple forums I have never been treated like this for making public suggestions. So there is truth behind what I have said so I had a right to make the comment I did. Now you are judging me on my comparision....you have "no right" to do that. Having a career in the automotive industry myself I know lots of people that dont know what those things are so I made it as clear as possible when I did that comparsion to avoid another "mid-grade bridges" debate. Which I am sure you have already read about....if not it's all above. I know the majority of you are pretty smart, but I cant leave out the ones who arent up to your level of intelligence...I am trying not to discriminate here. I like it here because I have a passion for cars....and dont tell to be a certain way....you have "no right" all I have done is try to be helpful, but have ended up defending myself for almost every post I have ever posted.

Smiles

Point taken. :)